What a BS story. How gullible do they think we are?

Then again, we did fall for the Iraqi MWD story..

you guys make me laugh.

I seriously am beginning to hope this country falls apart just like your average citizen WANTS it to. Just so people can have the more miserable lives they are asking for.

Not all of us fell for the WMD bull@!$%#. Some of us read the alternative and foreign press, and based on publicly available information concluded that there was absolutely no evidence for the Cheney-Bush junta's claims. We protested, but we were ignored or dismissed as left-wing kooks.

Did you also read all the left wing kooks who claimed Saddam had WMDs several years before Bush was even in office? Stop with the "I knew better" stupidity. Suuuuuure you did.

I didn't say we "knew." I said we saw no evidence of the claims being made and therefore refused to accept them. As for the 'left-wing kooks' who allegedly made claims concerning WMD before Cheney and Bush were installed, who might they be? If you're referring to anyone in or associated with the Clinton administration, those people are nowhere near the left. Whether they're kooks is another matter entirely.

It seems as if several of our government agencies fabricate situations to get a bigger budget. All intel, DEA, the Military Industrial Complex with it's greedy fingers grabbing for every tax dollar. "Wag the Dog. Part 2"

Stoogeworld.

Our president got a lawyer to write an opinion that is was OK for the US to kill someone in a foreign country.

Their president got a lawyer to write an opinion that is was OK for them to kill someone in a foreign country.

I guess the problem is they didn't use a drone?

I thought all but one of the 9-11 attackers was Saudi. About time someone attacked them. We would have done it ourselves, but we were too busy attacking countries that did not attack us. like Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Libya. Looks like Iran and Syria are next on the list of countries attacked by "the peace loving Americans" Yes, every day Americans beg to pay more taxes so we can give more to a military, who gave themselves 6 years and 6 billion to figure out their own books.

Yeah, I agree. I do hope you're talking about Bush having a legal team justify torture and extraordinary rendition.

marlen101917: What MWD? There is no such thing.

Oh, perhaps you meant WMD prgram, is that it?

By the way, do a little research and you will find numerous Democrats and Clinton Security officials-including Madeline Albright who talked up Hussein's WMD's along with both Bill and Hillary Clinton, Nancy Pelosi and John Kerry, amongst many others.

And Chemical Weapons, DO fall under the definition of being a WMD, just in case you again forgot your history of the Kurds in the north being murdered and maimed by the thousands by Sadam Hussein's Chemical Ali.

And who's this Isikoff character who so sincerely spreads this fertilizer on the stunted imaginations of the religious American? What is HIS agenda(e)? All of his 'sources' are anonymous and may be just voices in his head. Even the proShah Iranians don't buy this story and I'm sure they would LOVE to. And the absolutely strongest condemnation anyone could make for this story is that it comes out of texas. Nothing good has come out of texas in generations, only death and disappointment. Doesn't look like that will change anytime soon.

By the way, do a little research and you will find numerous Democrats and Clinton Security officials-including Madeline Albright who talked up Hussein's WMD's along with both Bill and Hillary Clinton, Nancy Pelosi and John Kerry, amongst many others.

Gharms asserted that 'left-wing kooks' made claims that Saddam Hussein possessed WMD. None of the people you named are on the left. Perhaps there are some leftists hiding among the 'many others'?

Yeah right, and Iraq had weapons of mass destruction.

What a bunch of horse @!$%#.

Looks like those Occupy Wall Street protesters in NYC and spreading across the country (and world) are making people in high places nervous.

It's the second oldest trick in the ruling class book.

1. Divide and conquer

2. When #1 doesn't work and the peasants start making common cause and realize who their real enemies are (in this case Wall Street/corporations and the politicians who serve their interests) invent an "outside security threat" to scare and distract them and maybe a little fireworks in the form of a bombing or even war.

How far they will take it is anybody's guess.

Maybe the guy should have called our government and found out when the shipment of firearms was going to be given to the Mexicans so they could share shipping costs - Okay that's not funny but wow they are really reaching for straws to start the next war.

can you say military industrial complex?

I also didn't believe that Iraq had WMD to that point but I didn't dismiss the idea of them having a few stashed someplace since GW went in front of the United Nations and proclaimed that they did have them. So that made me unsure of that claim. I figured I needed to believe GW because he was our president and he wouldn't lie to us and the United Nations about something like that. Little did I know he was an alcoholic boozehound dope addict that would say anything he wanted too and do anything he wanted because he was a cronic liar. Lying bum. Yes sir reese, he bluffed me on that and that was the last time I believed anything the bum said. Now this dope that Iran was to ship to Mexico, well I bet thats all for GW, yesiree, I bet its all for GW's consumption. GW is the biggest dope user in the world, no one can do as much dope as GW. The same with alcohol too, no one person can drink as much as GW, he can drink more booze than anyone else in the whole world. Yes sir reese he can, but thats because he's an alcoholic boozehound dope addict. So there you have it in a nut shell, GW is an alcoholic boozehound dope addict and no one can do as much dope or drink as much booze as he can.

And, mrpragmatic, please please please remember that America is not a team competition. Do YOU see any 'pragmatic' difference between the behavior of bush et al and the behavior of obama et al? We have a united elite/corporogovernment parasite and a deliberately divided America, divided into 'teams' of this and that meaningless political party. It doesn't matter WHO propagates the Lie, it all benefits the elite. All of our politicians work for them. This is what we must change, not the team logo label that happens to occupy any particular position. We must reclaim our government and put the elite and their machines, the corporations, on the tightest leash possible or, less desireable but more efective, kill them outright. In any case, as thousands of people all over America are currently making clear, we have a common problem: the American electorate's complete ignorance of their real situation. So, please, get off of the competitive horse and on to the cooperative horse. We need to save our country and being a red 'fan' or a blue 'fan' is not going to do it. Being an American and learning what that currently means is what we all must do ourselves and share with our friends, whether they like it or not. We are a divided people, Sir, and this myth of political parties in America is the worst and most successful tool employed by the elite in their dominance over us.

if there is not enough evidence, isn't then leaking this news is simply a public relation stunt? A dangerous move if there is not evidence.... Remember the WMD or Nuclear procurement from the past admininstration.

your all "dope" if you want to still try and blaim bush for @!$%# that hasnt changed in the last few years with obama in office. its not on the president. its on the country as a whole country.

as for the WMD's. 1st learn what WMD's are... they are any CBR weapon. Iraq did have them. as stated above, learn your history of what saddam did with them to the kurds. also, there is a reason saddam stalled the UN investigators for select bases (over a year in some areas). any stupid monkey could get rid stockpiles. since none of you are most likely in the intel field in the military let me teach you a few things. classified info is classified for 25 years min. it can be longer. so wait another 15ish years to see imagery of those areas to THINK you know what you are talking about. learn to think OUTSIDE the box; why would anyone stall if they have nothing to hide? yea... makes no sense does it? saddam wanted to show he is friendly with the UN bc at the time he wanted to get into the UN; so he allowed us to come, then as we go to the bases we really wanted to check out he is like "no no no, go here instead, you cant see these bases". right...... nothing to hide..... right..... i would go more in details if i wouldnt be sharing classified info. sorry! get off your lazy butts and join the military so you can find out information yourself if you wish.

back to the story. the whole middle east makes a ton of money from opium. this is common knowledge. the story about this is honestly pointless and is taking away from some wack job that attempted to kill a dipolmatic figure. most likely it will hold no weight as he came out about this after he was busted with the plot to kill someone. but also of course iran exports opium; just like everyone else here in the middle east does. this does NOT make them an enemy to the US any more than what they already were. the only thing that would change that is if its found out they really had ties to this wack job attempting to carry out a terrorist attack on US soil.

@ mrpragmatic

And Chemical Weapons, DO fall under the definition of being a WMD, just in case you again forgot your history of the Kurds in the north being murdered and maimed by the thousands by Sadam Hussein's Chemical Ali.

You do know that those were sold to Iraq by Reagan and his VP Bush, right?

Another bit of information for you. Remember when Clinton attacked Iraq? Who were the biggest objectors? Republicans but don't let that bother you.

Fact: Clinton made statements about Iraq having WMDs. Turns out their source of information was bogus. Whether Clinton had information those claims were bogus is not really known but irregardless Clinton never went against the UN with attacks on Iraq.

Fact: G W Bush had updated information that the claim of WMDs in Iraq were not reliable but chose to ignore them to suit his agenda to remove Saddam from office for personal reasons even going as far as forging documents of Iraq trying to purchase yellow cake uranium. G W Bush attacks Iraq without approval of the UN and the support of some major allies choosing to basically go it alone while sacrificing our effort in Afghanistan to get Osama bin Laden and the Taliban.

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,463779,00.html

The Suadi's, Bahran, Jordan and a few others don't export drugs...The Iranians and maybe the Syrians do. Most of what you said is true from what I have seen from briefings in the past, but good luck getting the sheeple to believe it. lol

This plot sounds like BS to me. Here's an excerpt from article I found online:

...

Workers’ incomes plummet during the Obama “recovery”

11 October 2011

As the anti-Wall Street protests against social inequality and the tyranny of the financial oligarchy spread across the US, a new study released Monday documents the devastating decline in working class living standards over the past four years.

The study, authored by two former US Census Bureau officials, concludes that inflation-adjusted median household income plunged 9.8 percent from December 2007, the official start of the recession, to June of 2011. Moreover, household income fell more than twice as rapidly during the Obama “recovery,” which began in June of 2009, than during the 18 months of official recession.

According to authors Gordon W. Green Jr. and John F. Coder, median real household income fell 3.2 percent during the official recession, a dramatic decline, but one far surpassed by the additional 6.7 percent drop between June 2009 and June of this year….

….Over the same period, bankers and corporate CEOs have grown richer than ever, thanks to trillions of dollars in taxpayer bailouts, unlimited cheap loans from the Federal Reserve Board, and the refusal of the Obama administration to prosecute the Wall Street criminals responsible for the financial meltdown or implement any real banking reform.

The growing numbers of people participating in the anti-Wall Street protests and the millions more in the US and around the world who sympathize with them must recognize that the impoverishment of the majority and further enrichment of the top 1 percent are not simply the result of impersonal economic forces. They are the result of the calculated and deliberate policies of the American ruling class and the Obama administration, its loyal servant….

…He has refused to provide serious aid to cities and states bankrupted by the slump, thereby encouraging the wholesale destruction of public jobs and services, especially in education, and a brutal assault on workers’ wages, pensions and health benefits. Now he is pushing for hundreds of billions of dollars in cuts in federal social programs, including Medicare and Medicaid.

He has pursued a policy of keeping unemployment high in order to use it, with the assistance of the trade unions, to blackmail workers into accepting wage cuts. It is not an accident that workers’ incomes have fallen more sharply since June 2009 than in the preceding months….

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2011/oct2011/pers-o11.shtml

Wrong article above. Try this one:

....Among those questioning the US claims was Robert Baer, a 21-year veteran CIA case officer in the Middle East. He told ABC News that the US charges were not “credible.” The supposed plot, he said, “doesn’t fit their modus operandi at all.” He continued: “It’s completely out of character, they’re much better than this. They wouldn’t be sending money through an American bank, they wouldn’t be going to the cartels in Mexico to do this. It’s just not the way they work.”

Baer warned that the US administration could respond to the supposed conspiracy with “retaliatory attacks, you know, hit, bomb a Quds Force base in Tehran, any number of things, of course, which would lead to a huge escalation.”

The ex-CIA agent suggested that the plot could have been the work of someone “attempting to frame the government” in Tehran.

Why would Iran’s elite secret service choose a bankrupt former used car dealer with a criminal record to execute its first-ever plot on US soil? Why would this individual be sent to Mexico to seek out and hire Los Zetas, whose enterprise is drugs and the elimination of rival narco-traffickers, to kill an ambassador in Washington? The US Justice Department has provided no answers to these questions.

The most plausible explanation is that Arbabsiar was in Mexico not to carry out an assassination plan for the Quds force, but rather to conduct a drug deal. Caught by the DEA, he could have been “flipped,” becoming an instrument for the US government to concoct a phony terror case against Iran….

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2011/oct2011/iran-o13.shtml

@ William Bjornson, Aloha, Orygun

It doesn't matter WHO propagates the Lie, it all benefits the elite. All of our politicians work for them.

What you propose sir would require the country to repeal the Constitutional amendment that give the people the right to lobby congress. As long as corporations can shell out millions of dollars to buy congress it will not change and the Constitutional amendment guarantees their right to do so. To exclude corporations the right to lobby would be shot down in the SCOTUS as unconstitutional but to exclude all the right to lobby would destroy or system of government. In other words....we're screwed.

@ ArchStanton

How convenient that you would leave out the Republicans in congress that refuse to allow any of Obama's job bills to go through congress. How partisan of you.

Crystal 5: Yes! Exactly! They are reaching for the next war. If you talk with conservatives, you will note that China is now starting to come up in their grievances in characteristic propagandic ways. If you've ever talked with a talkradiohead, you will know what I mean. The mouth opens and the radio comes out word for word what you've seen as the latest 'talking point'. The propaganda term "job creators" is a good example. But that one was too easy to destroy by pointing out the countless jobs actually destroyed by these people. In any case, China is now the new target and, whenever you hear or overhear someone be negative about China, point out that our elite in order to score a little more profit sold out our technology, our factories, our jobs, and our economy to the Chinese and that they are our own creation and we must hope not in our own image. Historically the Chinese have been traders, not invaders, or both Korea and Japan would be Chinese Provences. Jeju Island is one of the most beautiful places in South Korea, contains a Natural World Heritage Site, and is 20 miles from the Chinese mainland. We and our vassals, the South Korean government, are building a naval base there, destroying beautiful beach and ensuring pollution, in direct opposition to the inhabitants (531,887 souls) of the island. If China were to build a naval base in Ensenada, Mexico, we might have an issue with that. We will start pushing China and off we go on another round of 'cold war' praying there is no mistake. Or we end it now and remove the parasite who benefits from death and destruction, not an easy task as they own the sword. But penetrating the propagandistic cape gives our horn an opportunity to find their unprotected arsehole and skewer them before ever they can wield their sword (sociopathic police (see NYPD) and trained to kill on command soldiers who will kill their own parents if ordered to do so). Yes, Crystal5, I can say "military industrial complex", but know they are only the tools of our real enemy, our parasitic elite.

irrationalexuberance - Your comment "[t]he biggest shame on our effort in Afghanistan is that we have ignored one of our biggest problems, heroin being produced right under our miltary's nose to help "stabilize" their economy" is dead wrong. There have been programs over in Afghanistan to get farmers to convert from growing opium poppies to other high value cash crops such as saffron. The trend has gone back up a little because of increased prices for the poppies, but the production is definitely way down from what it was before we got there. The programs have not been as successful as hoped. This largely because of the rampant corruption in the Afghan government with seeds for new crops being stolen from the program and sold for profit. However, the program has still succeeded in cutting opium production by a considerable amount.

I am not at all surprised that the Iranian Qods Force is involved in drug smuggling. After all, the Iranians are right next door to Afghanistan where 90% of the world's opium poppy crop comes from. They need money to support their operations and drug smuggling is a very lucrative way of raising that money. It is also much harder to trace drugs used to pay for foreign operations than it is to trace cash. This makes it harder for the international community to prove the Qods Force is funding terror and assassination operations. This is not some made up excuse by the US to go after Iran like the conspiracy nuts want you to think. It is just a case of the Iranian Qods Force using a less than intelligent agent to set up the hit. His ineptness got them caught and is now causing major problems for the Iranians. One of the conspirators that has been identified is on the loose in Iran. The only way the Iranians government leadership could attempt to prove they were not involved would be to turn him over to international law enforcement for prosecution. The problem is, doing this would cause a huge popular backlash in Iran against the Iranian government for selling out one of their own. Whether the senior government leadership was involved, or this was some rogue element inside the Qods Force, the Iranians now have a huge problem to deal with.

See! As I have said many times before now. It has not been about oil at all... It is however all about thee drugs. We need to control the worlds drug sources so that we may perpetuate a WAR on our own people. A War FOR Drugs if you will. Not on them. Sounds crazy you may say? How crazy is this tea bagging republican congress for you? Hmmm. ;]

Cheers

You ever notice when a Democrat doessomething the left doesn't like, all the sudden they're "totally Republican anyways!". LOL. Been happening lately with Obama.....now it's "Clinton wasn't on the left!". The only reason they say that is because he actually worked across the aisle, and isn't pulling this partisan sh!t like the President and Senate/House now.

but there was WMD's in Iraq.some news channels released it, then it was then quickly suppressed then all of a sudden "oh, it was all old munitions not dangerous at all" but teams need to be careful because the contents are still deadly. Iraq used WmD's in the past and Clinton believed they had them and attacked Iraq, and that was ok, but then bush does the same ting but is more successful and that's a bad thing??? Liberals are very strange, at least the far left ones for sure. Even far right isn't that far from center as the left is. realize 90% of the entire us supported attacking Iraq, yet now 90% of Democrats say they were always against it. a total LIE!! If asked to answer with Yes or No only: Were WMD's found in Iraq? The answer would be YES!!! and the fact of the matter there could be more still, buried or moved to a place like Syria etc... probably not but it is still possible.

When it comes to drug use, we are experts at it. Every level of our society has been marked and affected by drugs. Understandably the Iranians, if they are involved, want a slice of the action and why not, everybody else does?!

Undermining our society from within, covert operations against our infrastructure and military establishments, as well as setting up a sleeper network within our borders could be a few other areas of interest to them. Established drug cartel networks could make the implementation of their (Iranian) plans and objectives so much easier. I think we may be in for a surprise, in the event we attack Iran and their interests in the Middle East in the future.

What would the Iranians gain from having a Mexican Cartel be found responsible for the assassination of the Saudi Ambassador Adel al-Jubeir?

To first answer this you must first know that the same Iranians have supported as many terrorist factions as they could in both Iraq, and Afghanistan since before the attacks on the United States 09/11/2001.

Theses Iranian special units have supplied the explosives, detonators, operational techincal use for the suicide vests, and road side bombs that the Iranians built and transported via their covert routes in and out of Iraq, and Afghanistan, and now Pakistan from Iran during the entire time our service members have been there.

Further the Iranians have provided key intelligence against our service members to these terrorist in placing these weapons providing satellites, covert humint-intelligence, and open source reporting.

Thousands of US services members have been killed by these weapons due to these Iranian Special Operations actions. The US Military knows this, and has recently started showing the bloody remains of parts of these bombs recovered … to the US Press.

US Intelligence has been keeping these actions to themselves as they were after Bin Laden who is now common fish crap in the open seas.

The Iranians have involved themselves voluntarily in a “Cold War” with the United States, and have been building and testing ballistic range missiles, as well as Nuclear weapons of which the ultimate goal is to threaten not only US forces, but all of Europe, and their surrounding Middle Eastern neighbors. The latest threat is the Iranians want to place one or more of their rusty half a## naval boats at the US coast if they don’t sink before they arrive.

So what would the Iranians gain from having a Mexican Cartel be found responsible for the assassination of the Saudi Ambassador Adel al-Jubeir on

US soil?

More world wide economic confusion …pure, and simple.

The United States would have had to have entered into a never ending bloody civil Mexican War, which would continue to exhaust the United States treasury for decades after US Service members have return from the Middle East … in order to answer to the Saudi’s how this could have happened.

The covert cover of a Mexican drug cartel would have divided two very powerful allies.

This would have cost the Iranians only a little pocket change, and they thought they had bought off someone they could trust. The Iranians have been watching the US political debates and thought that they had seized upon a weakness in our southern borders because of the discussions.

How stupid, to think that the Mexican Cartels would force the hand of the United States their favorite cash cow? And run the very high risk of US troops chasing them down?

So the lesson to this point today is: The Iranians who have been such slick sh#ts in the Middle East thought that they could operate without impunity in Mexico just found out that they are now on our side of the world. If the Iranians were crying before just wait, our politicians have been looking for any reason to work together, and it looks like the Iranians just crapped in their nest.

I can make one promise to these Iranian Special Forces:

I will promise to walk by foot for the rest of my life if I can turn just one of the keys.

I don’t even have to push the button.

The US doesn’t have to go through all of these sanctions, and UN meetings, or ask the Saudi’s.

In one silo, the United States has one missile that is so far advanced that it will deliver to your nuclear facilities, navy, army, storage facilities, communications, water supply, sewage treatment plants, fuel, depots, electric generators … and to the doorstep of the Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, multiple warheads were the yields can be dialed in were from 25 kilotons to 50 megatons as is needed, and it doesn’t miss it’s targets.

I say one because you’re sniveling butts are not worth sending more than one, we can keep the other 2000 just like it in place and still wipe your sorry memory from history.

You ever notice when a Democrat doessomething the left doesn't like, all the sudden they're "totally Republican anyways!". LOL. Been happening lately with Obama.....now it's "Clinton wasn't on the left!". The only reason they say that is because he actually worked across the aisle, and isn't pulling this partisan sh!t like the President and Senate/House now.

You ever notice how so many Americans are so politically illiterate that they believe the center-right Democratic Party is 'the left'?

I'm not a Democrat, genius.

Kater Murr, yes, I often refer to them as the Douchebag Party. But there are plenty of stupid people on both sides of the ailse. However, the stupid on the right think they determine what all the political definitions are. I think it has something to do with a really bad reading of the Bible, but I can't be exactly sure....

letmeexplain - Perhaps your name should be let me lie. You make a lot of allegations, but provide no proof of Iranian involvement in Iraq before and after 9/11. You also make allegations that Iran has been responsible for the killing of thousands of US soldiers. That is pure unsubstantiated bs. Do you think the Iranians stamp "made in Iran" on their weapons? Weapons of any nation can be bought from weapons dealers all over the world. Allegations do not constitute proof.

Prior to the war in Iraq, allegations were made about WMD, Niger documents, aluminum tubes , mobile biological weapons labs and so forth. They were all nothing but propaganda, conceived by Zionist neoconservatives, working in our Pentagon. The same people and the Jewish owned media were pumping out the same bs to the American public and our politicians, as if it all was fact. None of it was fact.

Here is a fact. During the Iraq - Iran war, the US did stick its nose into the fray and arm Iraq, including providing them with WMD, which they used to kill hundreds of thousands of Iranians and insurgents in their own country. No more wars for Israel.

Do they have any proof other than the guy with the mustache words?

Ralph- While I understand you think Letmeexplain made false accusations, you do the exact same later in your post. You really think Israel was so smart that they set up this last decade so they didn't have to fight any wars? Kudos to them if they did. Also, of course the bomb parts don't say where it's made but it doesn't take a scientist to realize that we have spies everywhere and can determine about what factories parts can come from. Years of intelligence. Terrorists don't have much of any fancy things to make their IEDs from so where do they get their armor-piercing IEDs from? It's logical to say Iran. Especially if there's evidence of similiar parts Iran uses.

Ralph. Iran has been implicated with arming the Taliban:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/afghanistan/7474666/Iranian-weapons-seized-in-Afghanistan.html

http://www.haaretz.com/news/u-s-iran-sending-weapons-to-afghanistan-fighters-1.265545

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/18/world/middleeast/18military.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/09/20/AR2007092001236.html

http://www.timesplus.co.uk/tto/news/?login=false&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thetimes.co.uk%2Ftto%2Fnews%2Fworld%2Fmiddleeast%2F

Also, the claims of WMD ownership were Saddam's. See here:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/01/AR2009070104217.html

Evidence enough? Or does someone need to take you there and rub your nose in it?

irrationalexuberance - Please provide a link for your numbers. They do not line up with another article I read recently about opium poppy crops. The article indicated an uptick this year, but that it was still way down from where it had been in the early 2000s.

For the Ignorants: the job bill proposed by President Obama, contains over 65-75% proposals by Republic House members and Republican Senate members. So if you think this Democratic preisident is Liberal or Progressive, then you are one sad case of ignorant fool. This President is centerist with right leaning proposals. Whether he chose to do so to compromise or it is his personal belief. It matters not. We elected him to be president to execute.

Unfortately, there isn't anything to execute. It seems everything is being stalled nor fillabusted in the House or Senate by the Republicans. By the say, the "Obamacare" is no different from programs that were proposed by the Republicans who pushed back against Clinton during the first healthcare reform go around.... REMEMBER?? Repbulicans were insisting that weren't anything broken in our healthcare system.... Of course we now nearly 200-300% premium increase...

Obama:

• Hero of the people in 2009
• Partisan hack until 2010
• Still atempting partisan hackery early 2011
• Finally compromising, but suddenly a "closet Republican" late 2011

LOL. This is the liberal thought process. He's great! He's sticking it to them! He's starting to bend over for the right! He's a Republican! Hahahahahaha.

Gharms, it is not anyone's fault for your ignorance, but your own. Nothing in the my sentences suggests that President Obams is a Republican. It is you and the likes of you who think he is a liberal. Thus shifting the center. If you actually know politics, you would have known that he is and has always been a centrist and a compromiser. He took pride in able to bring people to the table as suggested by our Constitution.

There are several Democrats (prior to the election) who thought of him as a more progressive Democrats. However if one actually studied his writings and his speeches, he was a clear centrist who probably stood to the right of Hillary Clinton. Given Hillary's pedigree (political connection), many liberals and progressives were concerns with her willingness to compromise (like President Bill Clinton). However, I believe people failed to take a closer look at her positions as NY senators and her earlier push in the Health bills while in White House.

However, given President's willingness to compromise does not make him a lesser man nor a Republican. Only in your wildest wet dream.... lol.

I agree with you 100 percent brendan-4 when will we stop for Politicians BS

There is much money in hate...only contentment and security in peace. No contest!

Some analysts skeptical of alleged Iranian plot

1. The alleged plot doesn't fit Iran's style

2. Iran would lose more than it would gain

3. Iran has much easier targets to go after

4. Iran is gaining in stature and isn't desperate for drastic measures

5. The alleged plot is full of holes

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/12/us/analysis-iran-saudi-plot/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

WWII ended the great depression, perhaps Obama and friends are hoping WWIII will fix what they have failed at, or perhaps they are hoping WWIII will finish what they have started, our destruction.

Ok, let us play 'let's suppose this story is true' game. If the implications are that the Qud's have people in South America who are capable of receiving huge shipments of opium, and they are tied to Hezbollah and Hamas and those groups are also in South America.....what the hell is being done about border security????

@pjam09 I've heard that WWII did help recovery from the Great Depression but didn't completely get America out of it.

I don't get why this story is so unbelievable to some people. They've carried out a successful assassination in the past. Why would they not try it again? As for the whole thing about them trying to get attention off the OWLS movement, I read about it this morning, heard about it on the radio, and saw it on the news. So if this is some sort of plot to take the spot light off of them, it's not working very well.

This may sound like BS, but I remember hearing about a certain country who wanted to kill Castro with an exploding cigar...Hm...

Thats exactly right Kevin. Yet I'm not completely sold on your assumption also, because GW didn't sell cars, did he? No he didn't and thats what throws me off a little on all this. Now we all know that all that dope was for GW and ok, he may of shared a very little of it with a friend or two but the bulk of that was for GW. Sure it was, we know that now because he's an alcoholic boozehound dope addict liar. Yes sir reese he is. Alcoholic boozehound dope addict liar. I guess he would take the dope and dress up as a cowboy with the sequences all over his hat, shirt and gun belt, maybe a couple on hs shoes but I doubt that because he wears his pants on the outside of his boots. So he jumps on his pony and rides out into the sunset and he's gone for a few days until the dope is done. Then the cia thats watching him picks him up along with his pony and brings them back to the barn and he packs some more dope up and jumps back on his pony and does it again. He won't ride on a wagon because he dosen't think real cowboys ride on wagons but he has all the dope wrapped up in his sleeping bag and he's out again, off into the sunset. Oh yeah, the alcoholic boozehound dope addict liar is playing cowboy now because no one will talk to him anymore. Not even his family. Once he's out riding his pony on his ranch he has his horse to talk too and if he thinks the cia isn't looking he'll kiss his pony. Oh yeah, thats what the alcoholic boozehound dope addict liar does now day. Yesiree.

Jimbob: sounds like you kinda lost the thread of the article there, it was about Iran and an assassination attempt, bashing Bush just makes you seem a little....confused.

One man, in the scheme of things, is not enough to bring down an organization like the Zetas. They very specifically design their organization in "cells" -- all answerable, eventually, to the man on top, but taking down one cell does not eliminate the entire organization. In other words, this informant probably told the feds all he knew, and it was enough to keep him out of prison, but not enough to "cripple" the Zetas. That's just wishful thinking.

End the drug war, problems all solved. No cartels, no Iranians being funded by drugs, no major gangs to fund themselves from drugs here, the list goes on and on.

ProIndividual, I have been saying that for yrs. Yes sir reese. Now if GW can get his dope from the drug cartels at almost cost shouldn't the rest of America be able to do so also? Sure, they can. Yesiree they can. Now GW is a heavy user and and yes he was president so maybe thats an entitlement for him because he's an alcoholic boozehound dope addict liar. To be honest maybe we're paying for it, I don't know that for sure, so when he packs his sleeping bag full of dope or I should say when Laura packs his sleeping bag full of dope for him and he jumps on his pony and rides off into the sunset and plays cowboy in his cowboy clothes with sequences all over his hat, shirt and gunbelt and he gets lost on his ranch and he thinks the cia isn't following him, because he gave them the slip he kisses his pony, yes sir resse he kisses his pony right on the mouth too, french style. So the alcoholic boozehound dope addict liar is out french kissing his pony after he gets all blowed out on the dope Laura packed for him and he finishes it all he pulls out a whistle he has around his neck and he starts blowing it til the cia picks him up along with his pony and takes him back to the barn so he can get some more dope and do it all over again. Yes sir reese.

One thing for sure is that GW dosen't like the string on his cowboy hat too tight around his chin but if its windy out then he has to pull the string tighter so he dosen't lose his hat. I guess it makes him mad as hell when he has to do that. yes sir reese it makes him mad. Well thats what the alcoholic boozehound dope addict liar likes and he thinks his pony likes him better like that too. No one talks bad about his pony because he will have a gun fight with them. Yesiree he will.

Sounds like you've been enjoying a bit of the old booze & dope yerself....perhaps it's time for you to get some rest in a quiet place. Breath deep and relax, deep breaths....that's it....

WMG-21,

That's exactly my point. Thank you. Isn't it even crazier to presume that the actions of 1 man can provoke a conflict with an entire nation? In the grand scheme of things, the Zetas are small fries. Iran ranks among the most influential countries on the planet, like it or not. With all the problems we're currently facing in the region, isn't it belligerent to provoke Iran on charges that even a Jr. high school newspaper editor would laugh at?

Very good. That idiot, jimbob11 doesn't know what he is talking about. His accusations against GW really are insulting. I take offense. He is confusing GW with the dope smoking, snorting, alcoholic, lying traitor occupying the White House now.

DeLaRick-- one person can provoke conflict with any number of entities (countries, corporations, gangs, etc). It happens all the time. Osama Bin Laden (for example) provoked America into a war that is now the longest running war in US history. What I objected to was your assertion that the informant in the case was somehow capable of bringing down the Zetas. That's silly. It's easy to provoke; it's a lot harder to "cripple" or eliminate a rich, violent entity.

isn't it belligerent to provoke Iran on charges that even a Jr. high school newspaper editor would laugh at?

Not if they turn out to be true. The evidence will come out in court. Either it will be verified or discarded. Iran has rejected the charges. They will have to prove their innocence and negate the evidence being held against them. Simple enough.

WMG - One of the articles said there was Persian writing on the weapons or munitions. It means nothing. We went to war with Iraq in part because of FORGED documents which implied Iraq wastrying to procure yellowcake uranium for Niger. Evidence can and is planted. Israel is the first suspect. the motto of the Mossad is "By way of deception". Israel has been trying to framre Iran, just as they did frame Iraq. There also was a computer which supposedly had plans for Iran warhead designs, which was planted.

I have seen your posts before. You are an Israeli propgandist.

No more wars for Israel. Stop all aid to Israel.

DeLaRick, read the article. The actual Zetas were never involved. The Iranian assassination agency THOUGHT they were talking to the Zetas, but they were talking to a guy who works for us and pretends to be a Zetas member, in order to catch people like the Iranians who want to hook up with the Zetas. Very common police/intel tactic. Most murder-for-hire plots that get busted are because the supposed hit-man turns out to be an undercover agent. Terrorists trying to buy bombs often get busted trying to buy from agents. This is not unusual at all, it is basic stuff.

I have seen your posts before. You are an Israeli propgandist.

Bwahahahaha! Really? Okay, okay... I admit that I rarely take the side of terrorist-providing, anti-democratic, militant regimes-- but that's because I am an American, not a Zionist. If you've actually read my posts, then you'd know that I frequently take Israel to task for their actions. Just recently I was posting that Israel's best step RE: the Palestinian vote in the UN was to acknowledge them. That would cripple Hamas! But no, of course, I am a hardline Zionist Extremist Mossad Agent posting the lies and misinformation of the Infidels. Of course I am, Ralph. That makes so much sense.

read the article. The actual Zetas were never involved

He actually was/is a Zeta. He was caught, and as part of his release agreement, he became an informant. That doesn't mean that he's not actually connected.

a DEA informant who he believed was an operative of Los Zetas

The article is not entirely clear, but this language suggests that he was not an actual Zetas member, though he apparently was a real drug dealer, at least at some point, to be convicted on "state-level charges" previously. Do you have some other information, from another article or something? Based on the article seeded here, I don't think he was an actual Zeta.

you know what was so great about that little deal was we sold bad or out of date parts to iran and then used the money to fund the contras. to me it was a great job. well done. did not cost the american taxpayer a dime and we got a little castro removed and iran was hoodwinked. god bless the cia! lol also it was great having democrats go into apoplexy over the whole thing. those were great years back then i was younger got married and got back at every f-n democrat by voting reagon and bush 1 in because of carters 10% luxary tax on expensive toys. which cost me my job and 30,000 others. never voted democrat again nor will i or my family. and after the last 4 years most of america wont either!

sound like you are a sheep for the republicans carl6342

Carl. Ha, I agree that Iran Contra was a pretty slick pragmatic move by our leaders and the CIA.

My only issue is the hypocricy of the "Contra" part. Namely, while Nancy Reagan was out preaching "Just Say No", her husband was funding the operations of the drug dealing Contras (who imported cocaine into the US) with the proceeds of the Iranian (and Iraqi) arms sales...all while waging a "War on Drugs" domestically that costs $billions of dollars and results in our prison overpopulation problem (and unfair incarceration). During the 1980's incarcerations for drug crimes increased 12x.

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States#Violent_and_nonviolent_crime

I could rant, but I'll hold my tongue.

Iran- Contra was an act of deceit, possibly treason against the sitting President - and the families of the hostages, and the regular American Joe - who's priority was the live extraction of all hostages...even at the expense of his Presidency.

Seems as though this is a great tactic for clouding the issue about Fast and Furious. How very, very convenient, Hum?

Just like Obama is great at going around the world apologizing for the US's actions in the past, most recently to the Japanese for Hiroshima and Nagasaki. They denied the apology LOL

Like we need more wars, we already have too many unconstitutional wars as it is

Brendan, maybe you should read the constitution. The wars we are involved with are not unconstitutional.

Jim, maybe you should read it..it says you have declare the wars through Congress with a DECLARATION not some BS authorization...and it also says the only other alternative is Letters of Marque and Reprisal.

Try again Constitutional illiterate.

Dear devin leonard - You say Obama is just the man to teach it to them. Wake up dude, Obama couldn't

teach a dog to sit - Why? Because he is too damned stupid, & the dog is smarter than he is, that's why !!!

"[Congress shall have Power...] To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;"

If you bother to read the Federalist Papers you'll see no part of the Constitution can be re-interpreted, not even by the courts, without an Amendment. The original intent of the clauses must be enforced until such a time when Amendment is passed, and which time statutes are written which the courts DO interpret. Statutes are not in the Constitution, hence they are up for judicial interpretation. Most of the States at ratification would NEVER have agreed to Constitution if this was not the process of interpretation. They expressly said so, read the debates at the time. This is agreed upon history by the federalists and anti-federalists (save Jefferson who was against the Constitution for mostly the failure to abolish slavery) alike.

Five wars have been declareed under the Constitution: the War of 1812, the Mexican-American War, the Spanish-American War, World War I, and World War II.

All other wars have been illegal...and legally speaking not wars at all. Hence why Vietnam was called by LBJ a "police action".

We used the alternative to war, Letters of Marque and Reprisal, several times...including the islamic terrorist pirates the Barbary Pirates. If we simply added air piracy to land and sea piracy this would be the correct means of dealing with a terrorist group like Al Queda that has no nation, army, navy, or air force to legally declare war on.

Learning anything yet, Jim?

If it was true that the war was ongoing, because the President had to repel a sudden attack, this was contemplated by the framers of the Constitution, in Philadelphia, during August of the summer of 1787, when the wording of the proposed Constitution was being finalized, the draft read that Congress could "make war." This was changed to "declare war" specifically in order to allow the President to defend the country from sudden attacks.

NOTICE "suden attacks"! Not pre-emptive BS or 10 years of nation building occupations to "win hearts and minds" of the occupied. COIN (counter insurgency) has failed as a strategy time and again, never been used in declared war, and only in fact worked once in all of history --- in the Phillipines where our presence was ACTUALLY welcomed (unlike the lie we're told: that we're welcomed EVERY time they go to undeclared war now).

"Mr. Madison and Mr. Gerry moved to insert "declare," striking out "make" war; leaving to the Executive the power to repel sudden attacks." That the President took decisive action to defend the country does not relieve the Congress of its Art: an obligation to vote on whether to declare and continue the war in an official capacity.

As you can see, resolutions are not sufficient.

The War Powers Resolution is also not an Amendment, and as such it does not overrule the Constitution as written.

In the area of the War Powers Clause, the flexibility provided by the requirement for a Congressional statute permitting war (a declaration of war) and constitutional interpretation could be sufficient. The President could defend the country, but not - by him or her self - use the military offensively. This would not require a Constitutional amendment or a statute like the War Powers Resolution; it has been with us since 1787.

As to the Philadelphia Convention and the intent of the American founders, there was only one delegate who suggested giving the Executive the power to take offensive military action: Pierce Butler of South Carolina.^[7] He suggested the President should be able to, but in practice would have the character not to do so without mass support. Elbridge Gerry, a delegate from Massachusetts, summed up the majority viewpoint saying he "never expected to hear in a republic a motion to empower the Executive alone to declare war." George Mason, Thomas Jefferson, and others voiced similar sentiments.

One delegate thought it a good idea...enough said.

As for Article Two Section 1 of the Constitution:

"The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States;"

But we've already established that legal authority is limited to "sudden attack" (which includes the credible and provable threat thereof, to be proved later to Congress when they decide whether to continue said action or not)...so this does not uverrule the Article 1 part. The President is the military's commander-in-chief; however Article One gives Congress and not the President the authority to declare war. This clause is included because it gives the President power over the troops, and under one commander, the military is bound to be more organized and efficient.

So, precedent does NOT equal law. And since it's clear the Executives who have violated this are violating a serious law:

Article 2 Section 4:

"The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other High crimes and Misdemeanors."

We obviously should of impeached most Presidents since the last time we declared war LEGALLY. No other interpretation can be had, without sophism and intellectual dishonesty (or laziness!).

Thank for being entirely full of BS, and spurring mew to destroy your nonsense claim that "maybe you should read the constitution. The wars we are involved with are not unconstitutional."

Oh really? Oh, you're not even f'ing trying...lol.

War is to be declared no matter if defensive or not...and only defensive war is a legitimate use of Executive and Congressional power...all you have to do is READ the Constitution. 10 year occupations cannot be argued to be defensive, by any stretch of the imagination. Wars should last a few monthes, or maybe a few years (with our tech, maybe even weeks).

repeat post

repeat post again

third repeat post for some reason

Bravo, Proindividual. That was very educational. Unfortunately, for a lot of people these days, telling them something is educational is like telling a kid something is nutritious. Automatic "EWW DOn't Want it!!". These days Children hold up their F's on the bus and proudly thump their chest and laugh, people see long posts and simply reply "TL:DR", parents pat their kid on the back and say "Yeah I was stupid too".....

Other cultures still hold a semblance of self respect and personal duty to themselves, family and their society. That includes not being a dunce and certainly not being proud of it. Sadly I feel your words fall on mostly deaf ears.

Repeat the posts as many times as is necessary, unfortunately most people never read it the first time....too educational.

F&F: Too bad that program was initiated by your boy Dubay. Secondly, I'm sure there is no shortage of arms amongst the Mexican drug cartels, I have not doubt they would would have another weapon to kill the DEA agent with.

And lastly, you've got some gaul blaming Obama for unnecessary deaths when Bush lied us into the most unnecessary war in our history which has led to the deaths of thousands of our troops, with over 25,000 greviously wounded and disable troops, not to mention in excess of 100,000 innocent Iraqis killed in the war, some by the likes of the BlackWater goons that Bush and Cheney sent in.

If that wasn't enough for you to make Bush resign, it's beyond me why you'd be so offended by any of Obama's actions. I mean, other than the fact that you hate him and would conjur up any excuse possible to denounce him

@Ozzie Boy

The program was much different during the previous administrations. No one was crazy enough to actually let the guns make it to mexico, all buyers were apprehended at the border.

Its alright though, keep trying to justify the largest threat to everyone's individual liberties, that being Obama. Considering he thinks the government has the power to mandate that people buy something from a private corporation and orders assassinations of american citizens without due process under our bill of rights and constitution, you should be scared, i know I am. Makes you wonder, who else is on that secret kill list and for what reason? Just speaking out against our country? Isn't that right protected? Considering there is no solid proof he has ever attacked this country, you should be very very scared.

BRENDAN: "The largest threat to everyone's liberties". You don't think that's just slightly over the top there fella??? Wait, don't tell me, you're a survivalist with a bomb shelter in your backyard and enough firarms to stock an arsenal, right???

Listen, I hated Bush's guts for the mess he made out of this country. And yet, I wouldn't resort to the kind of over the top prose that so many on the Right resort to.

And as for the dreaded "Private Mandate" the Right is screaming about, do you know who created it in the first place??? It was first dreamed up in the early Nineties by CONSERVATIVE REPUBLICANS IN THE CONGRESS who were terrified by Clinton's health care plan which would be "Socialized" medicine. (gasp) That's right, non other than the likes of Newt Gingrich help dream it up. Of course, now that Obama is for it, of course the clowns on your side of the aisle have to be against it. The fact remains, it was the brain child of Republicans and you can look it up if you doubt me.

Why would we want to be like every other highly developed, industrialized nation in the world and have single payer health care for all our citizens. After all, we're all rugged gunslinging cowboys, just like in the movies. Who needs that Commie health care.

And yes Brendan, I'm scared, but not for the same reasons you are.

Dear F & F is not only a Van Diesel Movie - When are we going to resign Obama ? Yesterday would be just fine with me !! I've often been for "underdogs" but NEVER for a "loser" and Obama is the absolute epitome of a loser !! What rock in Kenya did they find this guy under ?

Ozzie boy are you related to Jimbob?

Some analysts skeptical of alleged Iranian plot

1. The alleged plot doesn't fit Iran's style

2. Iran would lose more than it would gain

3. Iran has much easier targets to go after

4. Iran is gaining in stature and isn't desperate for drastic measures

5. The alleged plot is full of holes

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/12/us/analysis-iran-saudi-plot/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

WWII ended the great depression, perhaps Obama and friends are hoping WWIII will fix what they have failed at, or perhaps they are hoping WWIII will finish what they have started, our destruction.

Dear pjam09 - Pretty much agree with your comments except for the fact you say: The plot doesn't fit Iran's style - Since when has Iran had any style ? Rest of your input is good stuff !!

"Protective theocracy" has to be the scariest phrase I've ever read. So how exactly is it a republic if it's a theocracy? Not encouraging. You can always tell the bad guys when the very name of their country is a lie. North Korea is a democracy, too, didn't you know? Iran has one purpose: global islamic conquest. Anything and everything is fair game if it moves us towards the World Caliphate they dream of every day. They don't even bother to deny it. Just listen to any of their political speeches or "news" broadcasts. They are 100% dedicated to islamic fascism, anything else is a minor side issue to them. Murder and drug-dealing are a small price to pay to help exterminate all infidels everywhere, which is their only goal.

Not trying to start an argument, but most of the Heroin(opium) that comes to the US is now from Central and South American countries(where opium is now produced/grown along side cocaine). The Afghanistan opium(along with the Golden Triangle) supplies Europe, and Asia. I'm not saying some from those areas doesn't get here but its a drop in the bucket(or needle...big needle).

John: I am shocked, just shocked I tell you. Why, it is like the East India company all over again except that it is Britain's fair haired little former colony now involved. The British have a lot to answer for. Ditto the French. Rotten little twerps.

lol ^.^

Iran has assassinated who in the US?

The successful assassination follows:

http://openchannel.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/10/13/8294871-the-last-alleged-iranian-assassination-plot-on-us-soil-was-a-success

Why should you repudiate your country for what your government does? By that standard all American expatriates should repudiate the United States instead of just their government...

...but being a foreign national (and expatriate) is already a repudiation...you are, afterall, living abroad for a reason.

BTW, every government does this cloak and dagger BS. We also secretly imprison and asassinate people in other countries. I'm sure more than Iranians do it here as well. We have secret prisons and bases so secret that not even the Pentagon are sure where they are...and that's presumably their job!

The CIA and all foreign intelligent services do many things like this and worse every single day. Otherwise, why wouldn't the Pentagon be privy to every secret prison and military base abroad? The question answers itself.

Also, no one puts a gun to the head of heroin addict...they do heroin because they want to...end the drug war, problems solved. The drug war causes this to happen...afterall, the CIA is funded by drug money too. Our national budget is not top secret (when we have one), but the CIA budget is...so where do you think their funding comes from?

Selling drugs, obviously. See the Iran Contra scandal, and Ollie North for details.

I find nothing non-credible about Judge Nap...period.

Care to enlighten us as to why he is unbelievable?

I’m sure you bought into the Iraq war propaganda as well.

Judge Nap is the real deal.

They know there is a problem, but the boob in the White House refuses to deal with it until he gets an amnesty deal for the 10 to 20 million illegals living here in the US,. After all, isn't it more important to give them citizenship status here in the US than it is to protect the entire nation from terrorists attacks? Who cares if Hezbollah and Iran want to attack our major cities and kill our citizens and destroy our country, we have illegal aliens to worry about first. We need to get them jobs and entitlement benefits and make them legal voters.

Hey King - What did the boob in the previous White House do about immigration? He had 6 years, with a large majority of both House and Senate, as well as a majority on the Supreme Court.

Don't worry your chicken little head about terror attacks from across the border with Mexico. The story about Iran and the Mexican cartels is nothing but bs.

It is very encouraging to see the responce to this propaganda attempt by Clinton and whoever else is participating in this laughable effort to impune Iran. Our Zionist masters are trying their level best to provoke a US attack on Iran, but the American public is catching on to their tactics, slowly but surely.

The Wall Street protesters are also on to the games being played. Their protests are not all about Wall Street. They are a also a commentary about the the Jewish control of our nation's economic well being, which is controled by Wall St and the media. Abolish the FED. Stop all aid to Israel.

Hey Ralph... Pssst... Your antisemitism is showing...

Learn how to use the english language and perhaps you will find yourself a little more attractive to employers.

There probly is truth to what you suspect.

But also the islamists pay a tax. The tax is divided 8 ways. 1/8 goes to finance jihad. TRUE !!!

In what country? You act as if all arab nations have the same tax system ,or that even all arab/muslim nations are actively involved in jihad...it's flatly not true.

Iran, sure...but Dubai pays no such tax, and either does Saudi Arabia (not that they aren't a bad government anyway). I know also Turkey pays no such tax.

So you mean Iranians, not islamists. There is no country called "Islam-land".

I say give Iran due process, then execute IT. One good missile with MIRVs could glass all the significant parts of that toilet of a nation. Money well spent, and a nice live-fire field test as well. Win-win baby!

My almost funny what?